Karachi Yogini

Yoga for Life!

an unforgettable facebook conversation… September 2, 2011

Filed under: inspiring books,Islam/Sufism,poetry,spirituality,Uncategorized — yogini786 @ 11:35 am
Basic context:  A student from last year who I taught in university and I exchange frequent messages because of our common love for poetry and I guess esoteric teachings on philosophies of life and living.  Since yesterday we have exchanged MANY messages about meditation and our identity.  It’s been so fun and illuminating for me that I had to share it with all of you.  Thanks Fizza for helping me reflect and understand myself!
  • eid mubarak to you too! some reason i didn’t get your messages properly til just now. right now I feel like i need comfort. listening to the power of now. watching what is arising in me and allowing, accepting what is.

    you can get scuba diving cert from indus scuba school or another place called karachi something. I’m going to try and do it soon so i’m ready for the upcoming season.

    i have tried lots of types of meditation, some of the techniques are known as “zen” but I haven’t actually formally studied it. the meditations i tend to do are chakra based meditations, or just simple vipassana which is a buddhist meditation. very simple instructions just focus on your breathe and watch your thoughts. very hard to do:)

    reiki is very powerful. I’ve been feeling very different since I have been given the teachings. crystals are best for in person but you can also use them in distance. you can also charge a crystal with energy and leave it in a room, or give it to a person to continue the reiki once you’re done.
    hope you have a great eid!

  • i downloaded the sound version of power of now but i couldn’t follow it nor sit still and listen to it so i just deleted it and read the book. find reading so much better!

    Reiki is considering to be the best form of healing. healing of every kind. lots of people even use reiki help to treat mental disorders or diseases like cancer! have you ever used crystals before? i know you have been meditating for quiet sometime now but can you seriously control your thought? or even slow them down?

  • in every man’s heart,
    the leap of a mare

    each man has a bit of an ocean
    every lover has a bit of a beach
    on every beach
    there is longing
    and in the heart of every longing
    there is a rising tide

    every man has a thought
    years and centuries panting

    behind all the news and all the views
    always a burning word

    in every man dances a peacock
    in every man dances a thief
    every age comes dancing

    with swords floating down one’s throat

    every age, its own puzzle.
    – Hassan Dars

  • wow really nice. reiki is pretty incredible. as for meditation, and being able to control thoughts, i don’t think that is a practical goal like J krishnamurti says. but what i have been able to achieve is watching my thoughts, quieting my mind so that it is not my main source of information, and also being at peace even if things are not. through meditation i feel i am able to connect to a space beyond the mind like tolle talks about. it helps me practice presence and being. it helps me be. but again everyday is different. every meditation is part of the process. but the commitment, the practice is important. kind of like praying. the more you do it the better you get at it.

  • oh. well i hope you achieve whatever you want to through meditation. somehow ‘meditating’ sounds like hard work :o

  • hahah the mind i have when i don’t meditate is a lot harder to deal with 🙂:) have no goals in mind just know its the right the thing for me. and hope its for a lifetime. whenever one is ready I think life leads the way to whatever we need to be healthy and happy.

  • i guess yeh maybe it does. umm the mind you have without meditating is completely you. like all those are your thoughts regarding your life and everything in and around it. what if you somehow filter something from ur mind when meditating or block something important? wont that result in you not being so you

  • so i have only survived life in the last 2 years because i don’t identify with my thoughts. in meditating you don’t block thoughts. that would defeat the purpose. meditation is allowing yourself the time to watch whatever is happening, with acceptance and no judgement. its a journey inwards. and sometimes it is terribly painful, and other times exquisitely joyous. but the witness/observer in you becomes more present and so the joy or the pain become waves you watch and you accept wherever you are in the wave at the given moment. does that make sense? the “I” is also constantly changing, shifting, nothing is permanent and meditation teaches you that in a very personal way. One moment I may be sad, anxious, another happy and excited. Eventually you start to see that neither of those states are “you” or define “you”. They are just passing by.
    This is a really interesting discussion about meditation! I may just use it for my blog :) if you don’t mind being my muse!

  • but but we need to identify with our thoughts in order to accept them and accept us and our life. our thoughts arise from what we experience in our life. and thoughts are a very personal and important part of us. how can we not identify with them? at some point we have too! like in poetry a poet gives words to their feeling. their exact feelings. how is cool to not identify with ones own thoughts? yes meditation allows one to accept themselves and every moment but how is it okay if it doesnt allow you to find you. there has to be something that defines you as a person you. i mean you cnt say nothing defines you as everything is just something that passes by. that is a very scary thing to say!
  • oh i think i got what you are saying. you are saying that in a mind usually all thoughts are just jumping in together very randomly and at a fast pace giving us no time to process them but through meditation you can slow down the process of the thoughts jumping giving you time to understand and analyse each thought which is also why whatever feeling you feel is at a greater scale. if this is what you are saying then you are identifying with your thoughts in a cool organised manner.

  • hahah you’re great. so as you experience your mind, you experience your own truths. and everyone is going to have their own answers. one of the teachings that has resonated with me is to NOT identify with my thoughts. so I am not my thoughts, I am not my emotions. I am…that is all that one is. ofcourse this is a lot easier said than done because I do identify with many many things, but I think the better way to explain it is that my ego is attached to many many things which it believes “define” me.
  • so meditation, or just sitting with your thoughts, dont’ really need to formalize it, watching them as they come and go, allows you to detach from them, find patterns in them, and also of course there are thoughts that are important but those ones come from beyond your mind. they come from a deeper awareness we all have. call it consciousness, your soul, higher-self, God, doesn’t really matter. but that is the only source for creativity and transformation.
  • the other teaching, that is why I am so connected with Sufi thought, is that the heart is the doorway to enlightenment, path to liberation and path to God. We have to redirect our focus from our minds to our hearts (only cause we are out of balance). Ideally both should be in balance but when in doubt instead of going to our thoughts (which is what we and I usually do) we should practice to go with our heart.
  • so at times in meditation I also spend a lot of time just watching and feeling the energy in and around my heart. at the end of it all though the simplest thing is to just accept and trust. usually you’ll be guided to whatever you need to find that acceptance and trust in life.

  • Now you are saying you don’t identify with your emotions too? :o. It is not like that. You do identify with your emotions. emotions come from the heart. So how can you say that you listen to your heart but de attach yourself from your emotions and thoughts. And you are a poet. A person de attached from their emotions can’t be a poet! Your poetry displays emotions. Very good emotions! Plus people say to detach from thoughts and emotions if very painful, for a brief period of time. Not permanently! You can’t keep saying you are not your thoughts and emotions. Haven’t you heard something like, ‘we are our thoughts’. Both these things arise from our heart and consciousness too. There is a reason we cnt control them. I’m pretty sure that is the reason. Its like you are saying that if you feel happy or hurt you don’t let yourself feel that. And that is not okay.
    Or maybe I’m just not understanding you and your concept of meditation. :s. But whatever it is that you are saying is scary and I can’t stop thinking of what it is that you are trying to say!

  • oh i dont’ want to send you into a tailspin! I guess i’m sorting out this all for myself and there are no hard and fast rules. I agree with you that poets express their emotions and thoughts, that we all have them is not something i’m denying. it is important to allow yourself to whatever you are feeling in any given moment, never to repress it or distract yourself from it (which is VERY hard). but what i’m suggesting is that though we experience emotions of all kinds, though we think thoughts and those guide us and hurt us, that emotions and thoughts do not define us. do not define what we are. that we are greater and deeper than those. we are maybe grooves in the human and universe’s consciousness. I have no answer for what we are.
    I have also learned that we all swing between aversion and pleasure (buddhist philosophy). we crave pleasure (most of us) and avoid feeling “negative” things. this is because we live in a material world of opposites but internally we have the choice of freedom from these opposites. meditation is also witnessing this process more and more so we can have equanimity despite the suffering life gives us. i love this explanation that life is full of suffering, but there is true suffering and optional suffering (which arises from our unhealthy identification with certain emotions and thoughts).
    you will have to start considering what is my goal in life? what am i pursuing? when i first started to meditate my intention was to find peace from my negative thoughts and emotions. and truly through prayer, yoga and meditation I have been able to come so far on my journey. not just by shutting them off, because then they would just come back and be louder, but by watching them, accepting them, forgiving myself and others, and then truly letting them go.

    on a spiritual path, the goal is to liberate yourself, to evolve and progress, find your purpose on earth, and I believe most importantly, what you are here to GIVE rather than receive. our whole lives are set up so we can find our purpose. so in some ways as long you trust that everything that unfolds in life is meaningful, your purpose will become obvious. with the knowledge that as life evolves your purpose may too.

    at your age I was too immature to even consider the things that i’m writing to you. or to even have read the kind of stuff you have. There is no need to be attached to a mental position, you and I may see things very differently about what we are, which is great because in this exchange I’ve already learned so much! and have realized how much i love discussing this topic.

  • I feel very proud of myself right now cause I’m pretty sure I got 80 percent of what you are saying and finally it does make sense in my head! I thought you were saying you shut ur thoughts and emotions out completely. Plus whatever you do is working for you since 2 years so then for you that is the way or something like that. But this is a very complicated topic to understand!

  • i know i had no idea myself it was so hard to explain:) but i’m confident you’ll find your own path and it may look VERY different than mine.

THANK YOU FIZZA! I still have so much to learn I realize, and yet I can tell I am starting to get something at least. hope it helped you half as much as it helped me to have this conversation 🙂

perfect for how complicated my simple explanation has become!


75 Responses to “an unforgettable facebook conversation…”

  1. Sahar Says:

    I have been a university teacher for sometime now. It is rarely that we are lucky enough to come across students who challenge us into explaining things to them in a way that make us grow and learn.

    • yogini786 Says:

      Thanks Sahar, and more interestingly its on topics that I have never addressed in a classroom.

    • yogini786 Says:

      hey Sahar email me if you want to discuss this more. its good to have support as teachers. aishayoga4life@gmail.com. I’ve been very fortunate that the university I work at has given me a lot of freedom to teach and design my own curriculum. that allows me to connect with my work and the students, and so far I am more often amazed by my students capacities to learn and grow rather than being disappointed by them.

  2. Sahar Says:

    I find teaching in Pakistan to be pretty nervewrecking, classrooms have many barriers and children never ask what they want to apart from the curriculum designed and in return we or them never really get a chance to grow and learn at a personal level. I am sure you must be a great teacher willing to give time to your students to explain the ways of life to them. Also there are very less students willing to learn.

  3. Annie Says:

    Aisha the way you have explained everything, many of my questions have been answered. Such conversations are so profound and are truly remembered long after. i assure you that many times in your life you will see yourself reflecting and remembering this conversation. I am loving the poem in the middle

    • yogini786 Says:

      You’re right Annie, I have read the exchange many times already and every time i find things in it. I purposely did not spend much time “formulating” my answers but just wrote in the moment with presence. I love the poem too.

  4. Maliha Says:

    Aisha. have been reading your blog and many others for quiet sometime now. Reading this post i could not withhold myself from commenting. Where i can tell this blog is very personal something about having an actual conversation being a part of it gives it more authenticity and body. Conversations are what connects us to other people and in my experience there are just a handful which are remembered for a lifetime. I believe you will always hold this conversation with your student dear to your heart and memory. As Annie said they poem in the middle is lovely. It gives the conversation so much support. I have never come across this poet and searching him on google resulted in nothing. Can you please tell me where you can across his poetry? Wishing you both many such conversations and happiness.

  5. Zareen Lakhani Says:

    This link was shared with me by my colleague, Sahar. This post was worth a read. I read it thrice before typing this response and each time found myself relating, discovering, asking more questions and having them answered. As teachers and humans reading something like this gives us hope and renews our faith. Something about this conversation between a teacher and a student is extremely touching and heartening to read. I have a habit of developing pictures in my mind when reading and somehow it is difficult for me that such a conversation took place on the internet. Yogni, I would like to thank you for being bold enough to share your personal conversation with the rest of us and making us feel the way we do after reading this.

  6. Raheem Says:

    Today at my faculty meeting, this blog was shared as an example of a relationship some teachers are able to receive with their students. The moment i read this i know i had to read the actual post. The post was highly appreciated at the meeting. After getting to know how young the student is i just have to applaud you both. So much mental and emotional maturity are seen in a very few. Kudoos! Take Care.

  7. Alina Tariq Says:

    Always amazed by the curiousity of the young. Thank you for sharing this.

  8. Kamran Says:

    Lots of my colleagues have searched and read the post already. Just got around to doing it myself. Karachi yogni after attending many faculty meetings this was one of the very few ones that i was completely awake and interested in. Wish you could have heard the discussion that happened after the sharing of this blog. You give us hope of forming connections and also believing that young students are capable of much more then we give them credit off.

    • yogini786 Says:

      This is incredible. the last thing I expected. And yes I would have loved to hear the discussion at the meeting. It took me a while to understand how to create appropriate boundaries with social media, but I feel like I do it now with responsibility and allows me to stay connected to my old students and vice versa.

  9. Wajiha Gulzar Says:

    Few events, conversations and things change our life. Even fewer change others. your blog and this conversation is one of those things. simply incredible.

  10. Fatima Says:

    There is something in the middle of this conversation that reaches out and touches the soul.

  11. Kamran Says:

    Have been reading your entire blog since morning. Finding myself addicted to it. Loving every post but this one is my favorite. Is the student in this conversation an old student of yours? I simple assumed a discussion from classroom was carried forward.

    • yogini786 Says:

      the student was in my class last year exactly at this time, and she and i had this entire conversation online. nothing i taught in class would have prompted us getting so deeply into a conversation about meditation and identity. thanks for reading the blog and sharing your feedback. its really a great feeling to know people feel something when they read the blog!

  12. Summiya Ijaz Says:

    I had to decided to write something completely different in the comment box but reading the above comments a question has arised in my mind. Why do you think you both got into this conversation? Here in Islamabad your blog has become very famous and everyone is praising the relationship formed, the emotional and mental maturity and the affect of this conversation on others. What interests me is what do you think started this conversation? It is not everyday that a conversation between two people has a deep peaceful and hopeful effect on the third person who reads it. You may not realize it but reading this conversation does that. As i progressed further i found myself asking more more questions that get asked in the actual conversation in a better manner and receive their answers. This may seem funny but this conversation also reminds me of the books Maya and Sophies world by Jostein Gaarder. If you both haven’t gotten a chance to read them then please do. Your conversation can fit right in the middle of those very well with a poem to support. I love how your student has asked very challenging questions and tried to reach the answers to them herself.

    • yogini786 Says:

      Thanks! Yes I have read both Sophies world and Maya. You are right there is something similar in the conversation, I guess because it touches on philosophical ideas about the nature of our identity. I am not sure what started this conversation but we had been sharing a lot of poetry and creative writing for the past few months. For me I believe we were guided to have this and I’m sure many other conversations. Many times we forget that mystery is wonderful. And in some cases we don’t need to understand something as long as we can trust it.

  13. zainab Says:

    After reading this, i know why everyone around me has been sharing this post. Great piece.

  14. Subia Says:

    Superb. Although i am not interested in the field that this conversation is about, it still had me captivated.

  15. Saboohi Says:

    Heard wonderful things about you from my daughter, Fizza, yesterday. Thank you for answering her with so much patience and ease. Was an overwhelmingly joyful read for me. Best wishes and take care.

  16. Arshad Qureshi Says:

    Excellent and easy to understand explanation on of the most difficult questions that can be asked. Do you give spiritual or philosophy related lectures too?

  17. Kirat Says:

    This is amazing. I have never read an actual conversation between two people nor realized just how deep an effect a conversation can have. Thank You for having this conversation and then sharing it with us. was worth the read.

  18. hareem Says:

    Everyone already seems to have said what i wanted to say. So i will just say this was an awesome read!

  19. Rasha Raheem Says:

    My teacher talked about this post in class today and shared the link. really wanted to read it. It was an inspirational read. It feels good to know that there are people who can have conversations that will not only effect them and their life but also those who they share it with. I would be too shy and scared to openly speak of my queries and ask such things from anyone until i am satisfied. I applaud your student for having the courage to be able to do this and i applaud you for being able to answer in a very well explained manner. This is not a topic that is discussed very openly in Pakistan. What is discussed here are mostly politics, sports, etc. It feels good to read and know that there are people in our society who concentrate more on us as individuals.

  20. Mariam Says:

    After reading this post, i decided to first read your entire blog and then comment. Your blog is very different from 99 percent of the blogs. First it is extremely personal and tells things honestly and truthfully. With almost every post your blog has the ability to reach out and touch the soul. However, like others this is my favorite post. The reason is simple: your honest true self is greatly visible here along with that this post is an actual conversation. The questions asked are not stupid or immature but things that many of us ponder about but do not give voice to or simply do not know who to ask them from. I wish i was the one having this conversation with you 🙂 though im sure i would not have been able to ask the same things in such a mature manner. Was a pleasure to read this post and your blog.

    • yogini786 Says:

      Thanks Mariam, your comment is so heartfelt and honest too. I’m amazed how much response this post is creating:)

      • Mariam Says:

        Please do not be amazed. You both deserve it. Perhaps as someone who was part of the conversation you do not recognize fully just how deep an impact it has on someone who reads it. But there must be something very important about this conversation that you posted it on your blog. All your blog posts are regarding things that are very important and close to you :). Bless you and hope you have many more such conversations to share with us.

  21. Mariam Says:

    And thank you Fizza for having this conversation with Karachi yogni and giving us all a chance to read and be inspired by it. As asked by Summiya i also do wonder what caused you to start having this conversation. It is not an easy topic to talk about nor a highly talked about one.

  22. Razia Ahmedani Says:

    You are an inspiration.

  23. atiya rehman Says:

    People like you inspire others to change, grow and discover themselves.

  24. Gulzaar Says:

    Please keep healing us like this with such conversations. 🙂

  25. habiba Says:

    Karachi Yogni this is amazing. You should consider giving lectures on such topics or just writing on them. these are considered complex topics that are not widely spoke about in our part of the world and the way you have explained everything makes it very easy to understand

    • yogini786 Says:

      thanks habiba, that’s very kind of you to say. I do not know where life will take me, but I trust that I’ll be given the opportunities that are best suited to fulfill my purpose in this life. I do write about these topics a lot!

  26. Tayaba Sohail Says:

    This blog is everywhere for good reasons! Great convo you two!

  27. Rabia Says:

    i am at a loss off words.

  28. hunain Says:

    A while back i heard a debate on an international Tv show regarding meditation. It was interesting but not very solid or helpful. Though this is not a proper debate, it is still very helpful in getting the point across

    • yogini786 Says:

      Thanks Hunain. I think these topics are less to be understood from reading and writing, and more from experience and practice. I found explaining my experience in words very challenging:)

  29. Sahrish Says:

    never realized what a deep impact just reading something can have on us until i read this blog post. Though i have read many philosophical books and blogs, something about this conversation is very different and divine.

  30. Ghania Says:

    This is not a topic that i can easily comprehend yet i understood this conversation entirely in one read. Very easy and well explained. who are you people? you are changing the world with words 🙂

  31. maheen Says:

    It is people like you who should be our leaders. People who can guide us about life and its purpose and be bold to ask questions.

  32. Javeria Says:

    okay. No. This post took my breath away. Like Ghania i have to ask, who are you people? The two people conversing in this post donot seem to be one of us. You somehow seem above and divine. This conversation started as a chance?

    • yogini786 Says:

      absolutely by chance but from within a much longer conversation on life, poetry and randomness. so happy you liked it! hahah we are both happily human:) but I do believe if we’re open we can have divine live through us.

  33. Hajra Waqas Sheikh Says:

    Life, poetry and randomness sounds like a very interesting mixture to give a rise to such a conversation. I read all the comments and truly i have nothing more to add. I feel no matter what i write i will fail to do justice and might spoil this conversation. Yes, i am curious to know like every body else how it started and i believe we would all love to read some more of these conversations. In the first post on this blog there is a picture of a young lady if that is you then i have to wonder how old your student is. So if you don’t mind me asking your ages. I cannot picture two young people having this conversation. And incase you both are young then you both maybe be human but you are definitely more special and important than the rest of us. Please do share more conversations. Would love to read.

    • yogini786 Says:

      Our age shouldn’t really matter but if you read my blog you’ll find out i’m 30 and Fizza is 10 years younger than me. We don’t have any more potential nor are we more important. We are all on different paths towards the same goal: liberation, enlightenment (ofcourse many may disagree with me, including Fizza!). So happy you enjoyed the conversation and yes if there are more that have this quality of information in it than yes I will definitely share it.

  34. Munischa Says:

    Fizza, after knowing you for a long time, I am still surprised by your ability to question and understand. You are wonderful xo.

  35. sabika khan Says:

    you are a teacher? wish my kids were studying from you.

  36. Kamran Says:

    Had a challenging argument with a student today. blew out of perspective and turned very unreasonable. while looking through my saved links for something to calm me down i found myself reading this blog again. Yogini you are blessed with such students and they with you. Hoping both are well 🙂

  37. Hajra Says:

    Don’t know why but suddenly found myself back here reading this post after a long time. it is heart warming yogini :). i read this post last year and did not comment. this conversation was held between two people who are a decade apart yet so close. makes me smile 🙂

  38. Amtul Says:

    My facebook homepage was filled with this blog today. Did not quiet understand the conversation but was a good read.

  39. aaminah Says:

    I really enjoyed reading this conversation. We read such purity so less. Do you address any seminars that i can attend?

  40. Ramsha Says:

    I am a teacher myself and have never been able to have such conversations with my students. You are doing good work.

  41. Huda Says:

    Amazing! what do you teach? lucky student to get a chance to have this conversation with you.

  42. Samina Says:

    As teachers we are extremely lucky to have a few students who turn out to be brilliant and open. It is a pleasure to teach them.

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